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jshaw541

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Hi,

I'm looking for some creative means at rejecting (eg. not delivering to user's mailboxes) messages with a spam score of 10.0 or higher).

On Max's advice some time back, I attempted to set up a filter for:

X-Spam-Level with substring '**********', and also '\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\*'. Neither of these worked. Likewise X-Spam-Status with substring '10.0' doesn't work either.

On most UNIX implementations of SpamAssassin, you can mark messages as spam with a score of say, 5.0 or higher, AND reject messages with a score of, say, 10.0 or higher. This feature is sorely missing from KMS 6.0.

Does anyone know of a creative work-around on this? Please note that modifying the GUI settings won't due in this case, because changing those for this task would not mark messages as spam until they have a score of at least 10.0.

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Iassen Hristov

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It works for me with the following sieve rule:

# directly reject a score of 8 or more
if header :contains "X-Spam-Level" "********"
{
# just drop the message - rejecting it just generates traffic
discard;
stop;
}

Unfortunately this is a per-user setting, so you would have to add this to
each user filter.siv file in folder
store\mail\<domain>\<user>\

Notes:
- I am using KMS 5.7.10
- At least in KMS 5 the web interface does not have a "header :contains"
rule, so I had to add this manually (the "Edit script" button)
- I believe after editing the rules with "Edit script", the web interface
stops displaying the wizard and you are always in "Edit script" mode. This
might be dependant on other factors (rules) and since I have a bunch of
them I have not seen the GUI rule interface for quite a long time. Your
mileage might vary.

---
Iassen Hristov


--On Wednesday, July 28, 2004 9:38 AM -0700 jshaw541 <advertj<at>sps.lane.edu>
wrote:

>
> Hi,
>
> I'm looking for some creative means at rejecting (eg. not delivering to
> user's mailboxes) messages with a spam score of 10.0 or higher).
>
> On Max's advice some time back, I attempted to set up a filter for:
>
> X-Spam-Level with substring '**********', and also
> '\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\*'. Neither of these worked. Likewise X-Spam-Status
> with substring '10.0' doesn't work either.
>
> On most UNIX implementations of SpamAssassin, you can mark messages as
> spam with a score of say, 5.0 or higher, AND reject messages with a score
> of, say, 10.0 or higher. This feature is sorely missing from KMS 6.0.
>
> Does anyone know of a creative work-around on this? Please note that
> modifying the GUI settings won't due in this case, because changing those
> for this task would not mark messages as spam until they have a score of
> at least 10.0.
>
>





  •  
Iassen Hristov

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Actually it seems that if you don't nest checks and keep the line with the
description starting with #!1 you can continue having the GUI.
The following script brings the GUI, but will give an error if you attempt
to "Modify" the first rule, since it does not know how to display a
"header" check.

#!1 directly reject a score of 8 or more
if header :contains "X-Spam-Level" "********"
{
discard;
stop;
}

#!1 Move SPAM
if spamtest
{
fileinto "INBOX/SPAM";
}


--On Wednesday, July 28, 2004 1:30 PM -0400 Iassen Hristov
<ih.ng<at>databrokers.net> wrote:

> It works for me with the following sieve rule:
>
> # directly reject a score of 8 or more
> if header :contains "X-Spam-Level" "********"
> {
> # just drop the message - rejecting it just generates traffic
> discard;
> stop;
> }
>
> Unfortunately this is a per-user setting, so you would have to add this to
> each user filter.siv file in folder
> store\mail\<domain>\<user>\
>
> Notes:
> - I am using KMS 5.7.10
> - At least in KMS 5 the web interface does not have a "header :contains"
> rule, so I had to add this manually (the "Edit script" button)
> - I believe after editing the rules with "Edit script", the web interface
> stops displaying the wizard and you are always in "Edit script" mode. This
> might be dependant on other factors (rules) and since I have a bunch of
> them I have not seen the GUI rule interface for quite a long time. Your
> mileage might vary.
>
> ---
> Iassen Hristov
>
>
> --On Wednesday, July 28, 2004 9:38 AM -0700 jshaw541
> <advertj<at>sps.lane.edu> wrote:
>
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> I'm looking for some creative means at rejecting (eg. not delivering to
>> user's mailboxes) messages with a spam score of 10.0 or higher).
>>
>> On Max's advice some time back, I attempted to set up a filter for:
>>
>> X-Spam-Level with substring '**********', and also
>> '\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\*'. Neither of these worked. Likewise X-Spam-Status
>> with substring '10.0' doesn't work either.
>>
>> On most UNIX implementations of SpamAssassin, you can mark messages as
>> spam with a score of say, 5.0 or higher, AND reject messages with a score
>> of, say, 10.0 or higher. This feature is sorely missing from KMS 6.0.
>>
>> Does anyone know of a creative work-around on this? Please note that
>> modifying the GUI settings won't due in this case, because changing those
>> for this task would not mark messages as spam until they have a score of
>> at least 10.0.
>>
>>
>
>
>
>





  •  
jshaw541

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Thanks for your replies. Unfortunately, a per-user configuration wouldn't work in our situation as we have almost a couple thousand users. I am looking for a site-wide deal. I'm rummaging through esoteric SpamAssassin docs and .cf files seeing if I can come up with an adequate hack.

Nonetheless, you provided some pretty valuable information that will help me in other areas. Is there some sort of Seive language documentation? Where did you find out about this "undocumented" function?

Thanks,
Jacob



Iassen Hristov wrote on Wed, 28 July 2004 10:45

Actually it seems that if you don't nest checks and keep the line with the
description starting with #!1 you can continue having the GUI.
The following script brings the GUI, but will give an error if you attempt
to "Modify" the first rule, since it does not know how to display a
"header" check.

#!1 directly reject a score of 8 or more
if header :contains "X-Spam-Level" "********"
{
discard;
stop;
}

#!1 Move SPAM
if spamtest
{
fileinto "INBOX/SPAM";
}


--On Wednesday, July 28, 2004 1:30 PM -0400 Iassen Hristov
<ih.ng<at>databrokers.net> wrote:

> It works for me with the following sieve rule:
>
> # directly reject a score of 8 or more
> if header :contains "X-Spam-Level" "********"
> {
> # just drop the message - rejecting it just generates traffic
> discard;
> stop;
> }
>
> Unfortunately this is a per-user setting, so you would have to add this to
> each user filter.siv file in folder
> store\mail\<domain>\<user>\
>
> Notes:
> - I am using KMS 5.7.10
> - At least in KMS 5 the web interface does not have a "header :contains"
> rule, so I had to add this manually (the "Edit script" button)
> - I believe after editing the rules with "Edit script", the web interface
> stops displaying the wizard and you are always in "Edit script" mode. This
> might be dependant on other factors (rules) and since I have a bunch of
> them I have not seen the GUI rule interface for quite a long time. Your
> mileage might vary.
>
> ---
> Iassen Hristov
>
>
> --On Wednesday, July 28, 2004 9:38 AM -0700 jshaw541
> <advertj<at>sps.lane.edu> wrote:
>
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> I'm looking for some creative means at rejecting (eg. not delivering to
>> user's mailboxes) messages with a spam score of 10.0 or higher).
>>
>> On Max's advice some time back, I attempted to set up a filter for:
>>
>> X-Spam-Level with substring '**********', and also
>> '\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\*'. Neither of these worked. Likewise X-Spam-Status
>> with substring '10.0' doesn't work either.
>>
>> On most UNIX implementations of SpamAssassin, you can mark messages as
>> spam with a score of say, 5.0 or higher, AND reject messages with a score
>> of, say, 10.0 or higher. This feature is sorely missing from KMS 6.0.
>>
>> Does anyone know of a creative work-around on this? Please note that
>> modifying the GUI settings won't due in this case, because changing those
>> for this task would not mark messages as spam until they have a score of
>> at least 10.0.
>>
>>
>
>
>
>








Kerio MailServer 6.7.1 w/AD
Windows Server 2003 SP 1
Dell PowerEdge 2850 (Dual Xeon 3.2ghz and 2 GB RAM)
~1300 users
~1000+ concurrent IMAPS connections
iPhone users
Outlook 2007 KOFF users
Apple iCal 10.5/10.6 users
  •  
Iassen Hristov

Messages: 54
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Sieve is an RFC
<http://www.cyrusoft.com/sieve/>

I use Mulberry as my e-mail client and it is capable of generating Sieve
scripts from a GUI interface.

Keep in mind that some rules are extensions to the standard and are not
implemented by KMS.

---
Iassen Hristov

--On Wednesday, July 28, 2004 10:58 AM -0700 jshaw541
<advertj<at>sps.lane.edu> wrote:

>
> Thanks for your replies. Unfortunately, a per-user configuration wouldn't
> work in our situation as we have almost a couple thousand users. I am
> looking for a site-wide deal. I'm rummaging through esoteric SpamAssassin
> docs and .cf files seeing if I can come up with an adequate hack.
>
> Nonetheless, you provided some pretty valuable information that will help
> me in other areas. Is there some sort of Seive language documentation?
> Where did you find out about this "undocumented" function?
>
> Thanks,
> Jacob
>
>
>
> Iassen Hristov wrote on Wed, 28 July 2004 10:45
>> Actually it seems that if you don't nest checks and keep the line with
>> the description starting with #!1 you can continue having the GUI. The
>> following script brings the GUI, but will give an error if you attempt
>> to "Modify" the first rule, since it does not know how to display a
>> "header" check.
>>
>> # !1 directly reject a score of 8 or more
>> if header :contains "X-Spam-Level" "********"
>> {
>> discard;
>> stop;
>> }
>>
>> # !1 Move SPAM
>> if spamtest
>> {
>> fileinto "INBOX/SPAM";
>> }
>>
>>
>> --On Wednesday, July 28, 2004 1:30 PM -0400 Iassen Hristov
>> <ih.ng<at>databrokers.net> wrote:
>>
>> > It works for me with the following sieve rule:
>> >
>> > # directly reject a score of 8 or more
>> > if header :contains "X-Spam-Level" "********"
>> > {
>> > # just drop the message - rejecting it just generates traffic
>> > discard;
>> > stop;
>> > }
>> >
>> > Unfortunately this is a per-user setting, so you would have to add
>> > this to each user filter.siv file in folder
>> > store\mail\<domain>\<user>\
>> >
>> > Notes:
>> > - I am using KMS 5.7.10
>> > - At least in KMS 5 the web interface does not have a "header
>> > :contains" rule, so I had to add this manually (the "Edit script"
>> > button) - I believe after editing the rules with "Edit script", the
>> > web interface stops displaying the wizard and you are always in "Edit
>> > script" mode. This might be dependant on other factors (rules) and
>> > since I have a bunch of them I have not seen the GUI rule interface
>> > for quite a long time. Your mileage might vary.
>> >
>> > ---
>> > Iassen Hristov
>> >
>> >
>> > --On Wednesday, July 28, 2004 9:38 AM -0700 jshaw541
>> > <advertj<at>sps.lane.edu> wrote:
>> >
>> >>
>> >> Hi,
>> >>
>> >> I'm looking for some creative means at rejecting (eg. not delivering
>> >> to user's mailboxes) messages with a spam score of 10.0 or higher).
>> >>
>> >> On Max's advice some time back, I attempted to set up a filter for:
>> >>
>> >> X-Spam-Level with substring '**********', and also
>> >> '\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\*'. Neither of these worked. Likewise
>> >> X-Spam-Status with substring '10.0' doesn't work either.
>> >>
>> >> On most UNIX implementations of SpamAssassin, you can mark messages as
>> >> spam with a score of say, 5.0 or higher, AND reject messages with a
>> >> score of, say, 10.0 or higher. This feature is sorely missing from
>> >> KMS 6.0.
>> >>
>> >> Does anyone know of a creative work-around on this? Please note that
>> >> modifying the GUI settings won't due in this case, because changing
>> >> those for this task would not mark messages as spam until they have a
>> >> score of at least 10.0.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>
>
>
>





  •  
jshaw541

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Most excellent, thank you! Yet another language to learn.

More on my situation:

I think that I'm not able to filter on the X-Spam-* headers because they have not been inserted into the message at the point at which SpamEliminator is scanning the message.

Can someone from Kerio briefly explain the process chain on how this works? Is it 'SpamEliminator->SpamAssassin->delivery' or
are Spamassassin and SpamEliminator filters taking place at the same time?

SpamAssassin rules and SpamEliminator rules (defined in the GUI) appear to be completely separate. Am I correct? Which one's rules are processed first?

Thanks,
Jacob


Iassen Hristov wrote on Wed, 28 July 2004 11:31

Sieve is an RFC
<http://www.cyrusoft.com/sieve/>



Kerio MailServer 6.7.1 w/AD
Windows Server 2003 SP 1
Dell PowerEdge 2850 (Dual Xeon 3.2ghz and 2 GB RAM)
~1300 users
~1000+ concurrent IMAPS connections
iPhone users
Outlook 2007 KOFF users
Apple iCal 10.5/10.6 users
  •  
Iassen Hristov

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Actually speaking of SPAM I would have preferred if one could configure the
server so that it "does not accept" a mail that scores more than certain
points. Right now this is impossible, because the SPAM score is tested
after the QUIT, but I don't see why can't it be implemented with a check on
the spot (before the QUIT command). I believe this would send a strong
message to a lot of SPAMers. Right now the server accepts the msg for
delivery, so as far as the SPAMer is concerned it was delivered and they
probably get money for it. If however the server does not accept the
message for delivery, they would have no right to claim they delivered it.
Granted dumb applications will probably try again and this could
potentially generate more traffic than it should, but I believe it is a
viable practice in some scenarios.

Ideally this would be a per domain setting that can be overridden per user.

Imagine if the session could be

[28/Jul/2004 15:08:50][1860] {smtps} Server session begin; client connected
from 123.123.123.123:1190
[28/Jul/2004 15:08:50][1860] {smtps} Looking up address 123.123.123.123 in
DNS blacklist china.blackholes.us...
...
[28/Jul/2004 15:08:52][1860] {smtps} 5037 bytes received in command DATA
[28/Jul/2004 15:08:52][1860] {spam} SpamEliminator score for message from
<spammer> to <user>: 9.11, time 1.01s
[24/Jul/2004 15:08:52][1860] {smtps} Sent reply to MAIL: xxx 5.x.x
Recipient does not accept SPAM messages
[24/Jul/2004 15:08:52][1860] {smtps} Command RSET
[24/Jul/2004 15:08:52][1860] {smtps} Command QUIT
[28/Jul/2004 15:08:52][1860] {smtps} SMTP server session end

instead of

[28/Jul/2004 15:08:50][1860] {smtps} Server session begin; client connected
from 123.123.123.123:1190
[28/Jul/2004 15:08:50][1860] {smtps} Looking up address 123.123.123.123 in
DNS blacklist china.blackholes.us...
...
[28/Jul/2004 15:08:52][1860] {smtps} 5037 bytes received in command DATA
[28/Jul/2004 15:08:52][1860] {smtps} Message accepted for delivery
[28/Jul/2004 15:08:52][1860] {smtps} Command QUIT
[28/Jul/2004 15:08:52][1860] {smtps} SMTP server session end
[28/Jul/2004 15:08:53][1860] {spam} SpamEliminator score for message from
<spammer> to <user>: 9.11, time 1.01s

---
Iassen Hristov

--On Wednesday, July 28, 2004 11:40 AM -0700 jshaw541
<advertj<at>sps.lane.edu> wrote:

>
> Most excellent, thank you! Yet another language to learn.
>
> More on my situation:
>
> I think that I'm not able to filter on the X-Spam-* headers because they
> have not been inserted into the message at the point at which
> SpamEliminator is scanning the message.
>
> Can someone from Kerio briefly explain the process chain on how this
> works? Is it 'SpamEliminator->SpamAssassin->delivery' or are
> Spamassassin and SpamEliminator filters taking place at the same time?
>
> SpamAssassin rules and SpamEliminator rules (defined in the GUI) appear
> to be completely separate. Am I correct? Which one's rules are processed
> first?
>
> Thanks,
> Jacob
>
>
> Iassen Hristov wrote on Wed, 28 July 2004 11:31
>> Sieve is an RFC
>> <http://www.cyrusoft.com/sieve/>
>
>
>
>





  •  
jshaw541

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An update on my progress:

I can't find any way to devise a method to block messages with a score greater than x + y (x being the score at which a message is marked as spam).

- SpamAssassin seems to have no blocking/rejecting functionality whatsoever. The SpamAssassin folks recommend a procmail rule or a postfix cf rule. Neither of which, Kerio utilizes, of course.

- Setting up a SpamEliminator rule to check the headers SpamAssassion doesn't seem to work, probably because SpamAssassin hasn't injected it's headers into the message at this point.

- I even came up with a crazy idea of getting the message's spam score and inserting the EICAR test string into the subject or message body, so that the AV scanner would reject it, but couldn't find any search/replace regex functionality in SpamAssassin.

So, this sucks, as I must still maintain my external mail gateway to do spam filtering.

These one or two things would be cool if implemented:

- Server-wide Sieve filtering

- Add another score level to the "If message's score is higher than" section of the Admin Console. Something so that we can say mark messages with a score of >=x.0 as spam, and do ____ with messages with a score higher than y.0.

- Having SpamEliminator scan a message AFTER SpamAssassin has checked it and inserted it's X-Spam-* headers. I don't think this one is possible, because I think they are one and the same, with some sort of rules separation hack.

Kerio MailServer 6.7.1 w/AD
Windows Server 2003 SP 1
Dell PowerEdge 2850 (Dual Xeon 3.2ghz and 2 GB RAM)
~1300 users
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iPhone users
Outlook 2007 KOFF users
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  •  
pwhodges

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Iassen Hristov wrote on Wed, 28 July 2004 19:31

I use Mulberry as my e-mail client and it is capable of generating Sieve scripts from a GUI interface.


Does this mean that you are using the (now hidden) Sieve interface of KMS? I couldn't get that to work...

Paul
  •  
jshaw541

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pwhodges wrote on Wed, 04 August 2004 03:10

Iassen Hristov wrote on Wed, 28 July 2004 19:31

I use Mulberry as my e-mail client and it is capable of generating Sieve scripts from a GUI interface.


Does this mean that you are using the (now hidden) Sieve interface of KMS? I couldn't get that to work...

Paul



Which Seive interface are you referring to? The per-user, or a per-server deal?

Kerio MailServer 6.7.1 w/AD
Windows Server 2003 SP 1
Dell PowerEdge 2850 (Dual Xeon 3.2ghz and 2 GB RAM)
~1300 users
~1000+ concurrent IMAPS connections
iPhone users
Outlook 2007 KOFF users
Apple iCal 10.5/10.6 users
  •  
Iassen Hristov

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I am still using KMS 5, so I don't know how has the sieve interface
changed. However I am sure it is still there. Isn't there a button "Edit
script" under "Settings/Filters and notifications" anymore?

--On Wednesday, August 04, 2004 11:10 AM +0100 pwhodges
<pwh-kerio<at>cassland.org> wrote:

>
> Iassen Hristov wrote on Wed, 28 July 2004 19:31
>> I use Mulberry as my e-mail client and it is capable of generating Sieve
>> scripts from a GUI interface.
>
> Does this mean that you are using the (now hidden) Sieve interface of
> KMS? I couldn't get that to work...
>
> Paul
>
>
>





  •  
Iassen Hristov

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As far as I know there isn't a "per-server" interface in KMS 5. Is this new
in KMS 6?

--On Wednesday, August 04, 2004 8:02 AM -0700 jshaw541
<advertj<at>sps.lane.edu> wrote:

>
> pwhodges wrote on Wed, 04 August 2004 03:10
>> Iassen Hristov wrote on Wed, 28 July 2004 19:31
>> > I use Mulberry as my e-mail client and it is capable of generating
>> > Sieve scripts from a GUI interface.
>>
>> Does this mean that you are using the (now hidden) Sieve interface of
>> KMS? I couldn't get that to work...
>>
>> Paul
>
>
> Which Seive interface are you referring to? The per-user, or a per-server
> deal?
>
>





  •  
jshaw541

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Iassen Hristov wrote on Wed, 04 August 2004 08:13

As far as I know there isn't a "per-server" interface in KMS 5. Is this new
in KMS 6?

--On Wednesday, August 04, 2004 8:02 AM -0700 jshaw541
<advertj<at>sps.lane.edu> wrote:

>
> pwhodges wrote on Wed, 04 August 2004 03:10
>> Iassen Hristov wrote on Wed, 28 July 2004 19:31
>> > I use Mulberry as my e-mail client and it is capable of generating
>> > Sieve scripts from a GUI interface.
>>
>> Does this mean that you are using the (now hidden) Sieve interface of
>> KMS? I couldn't get that to work...
>>
>> Paul
>
>
> Which Seive interface are you referring to? The per-user, or a per-server
> deal?
>
>




I think we've caused some mutual confusion. I saw mention of some hidden Sieve filtering deal and was wondering outloud if this hidden thing was a per-server or per-user. As far as I know, there is no per-server Sieve filtering.

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pwhodges

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jshaw541 wrote on Wed, 04 August 2004 16:02

pwhodges wrote on Wed, 04 August 2004 03:10

Iassen Hristov wrote on Wed, 28 July 2004 19:31

I use Mulberry as my e-mail client and it is capable of generating Sieve scripts from a GUI interface.


Does this mean that you are using the (now hidden) Sieve interface of KMS? I couldn't get that to work...


Which Sieve interface are you referring to? The per-user, or a per-server deal?


Port 2000. This is the port that Mulberry is supposed to be able to use to edit sieve on the server. I couldn't get it to work, and Kerio hid it from the admin program sometime during the 5.x series (though existing settings are retained, so mine is still live; I haven't checked if it's been dumped in v6, now I think of it!).

Paul
jshaw541

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pwhodges wrote on Wed, 04 August 2004 09:50


Port 2000. This is the port that Mulberry is supposed to be able to use to edit sieve on the server. I couldn't get it to work, and Kerio hid it from the admin program sometime during the 5.x series (though existing settings are retained, so mine is still live; I haven't checked if it's been dumped in v6, now I think of it!).

Paul


TCP port 2000 is still listening in KMS 6.0 ... interesting... didn't know about this...

but this only works per-user, correct?

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